shoptalk-digest Thursday, 26 September 1996 Volume 01 : Number 014


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Joakim Thrane <Joakim.Thrane@bebslint.origin.nl>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 12:02:49 -0700
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: When building a 6, 7, 8 wood...

John Lunsford wrote:
>
> At 11:48 AM 9/23/96 -0700, you wrote:
> >I am thinking of building a utility wood. My aim being to get the ball
> >easier out of roughs etc compared to my 4-5 iron (185-200 yards).
> >What specs (loft and length, head weight)) should I be looking for if I
> >want to build this type if club and keeping the above distance. ?
> >I am thinking of using the dynalite shaft (110grams I believe) tip trimed
> >to match my 3 wood (16 degree, D1).
> >
> >Suggestions are welcome.
> >
> >Does the Copperhead only come as a driver or are there 3, 5, 7, woods ?
> >
> >Regards from Belgium
> >Joakim
>
> Not sure about 7 wood, but I just completed a set of Copperhead 1,3, and 5
> with matching Copperhead graphite shafts and grips. A very handsome set.
>
> >
> >What is the loft of the 3 and 5 wood ?

------------------------------

From: Paul%CWOCMHS.CWOC@smtpgwy.des.state.mn.us
Date: 24 Sep 96 10:55:46 CDT
Subject: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

If King Snake is now an 'illegal head' (to manufacture anyway), does
that mean that players using the head would be disqualified during
tournament play?

Can grips be taken off of shafts and reused? These particular grips
are Golf Pride Tour Wrap (about 1.5 yrs old).

------------------------------

From: mpace@juno.com (Morgan W Pace)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 12:13:08 PST
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

On 24 Sep 96 10:55:46 CDT Paul%CWOCMHS.CWOC@smtpgwy.des.state.mn.us
writes:
>If King Snake is now an 'illegal head' (to manufacture anyway), does
>that mean that players using the head would be disqualified during
>tournament play?
>
>Can grips be taken off of shafts and reused? These particular grips
>are Golf Pride Tour Wrap (about 1.5 yrs old).
>
I don't know anything about "illegal heads", but suggest you check out
page 135 &136 of the '96 Golfsmith catalog for tools/techniques for grip
removal. If you don't have a catalog you can call them at 800-456 3344,

------------------------------

From: Eric Burcham <crawdad@onramp.net>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 16:51:49 -0500
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

>>Can grips be taken off of shafts and reused? These particular grips
>>are Golf Pride Tour Wrap (about 1.5 yrs old).
>>
... Yes, they can. I take it these are for a customer? If he plays much at
all, he should probably
have you put on new ones (about $1.70 a piece), as they do wear and get
"slick" over time.
I change mine yearly, and it kind of "spruces up" the set at the beginning
of the year... I know
that I would HAVE to change mine at 18 months! BTW, you might try the Golf
Pride Tour Wrap
Velvets... nice.
=================================================

Eric Burcham
(crawdad@onramp.net,
eric.burcham@target.commercemail.com)
=================================================


------------------------------

From: jhm@clubmaker-online.com
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 19:45:23 +0100
Subject: ShopTalk: AJ TECH SHAFTS/input

I may have the opportunity to sell AJ Tech Shafts through my web site
(Clubmaker Online) and would like to get the opinion of readers of my
discussion group regarding these shafts. They make an ultralight shaft that
you assemble without grips! Their other shafts are very popular on the
Senior Tour and they seem to offer a very unique product. Is this type of
product of interest to you? They have a fairly high price point but might
offer you the opportunity to make a very unique/high performance club.
Please respond at jhm@clubmaker-online.com (not to the list, please). I
will be in Louisville at the PCS show this Friday and Saturday and will do
a review when I return. Anything you'd like me to pass along to the
component companies?
Thanks for helping me out.
John Muir
Clubmaker Online

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The name golf arose by default-all the other four-letter words had already
been taken-George Peper, writer http://clubmaker-online.com
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^



------------------------------

From: "John G. Bowman" <clubfitter@mindspring.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 20:04:30 +0000
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

On 24 Sep 96 at 10:55, Paul%CWOCMHS.CWOC@smtpgwy.des wrote:

> If King Snake is now an 'illegal head' (to manufacture anyway), does
> that mean that players using the head would be disqualified during
> tournament play?
>
> Can grips be taken off of shafts and reused? These particular grips
> are Golf Pride Tour Wrap (about 1.5 yrs old).


I'm not sure about the heads, but heres some info on the grips.

There are primarily two methods for removing grips in a re-usable
state:

(1) Using an industrial type syringe to inject grip solvent into the
sides of the grip. This disolves the adheasion of the tape.
(2) Using an air compressor, blow air down through the grip hole,
causing forced separation of the grip and tape.

The first time I needed this done, I took them to a pro shop. They
used the syringe method and could only remove 3 of the 6 grips. I then
borrowed a compressor to blow the others off and found it difficult due
to the syringe holes in the grip. However, I did succeed.

Now, I use a method that combines the benefits of both.

I insert an air needle, the kind used for inflating basketballs,
in the grip hole and get it between the shaft and grip. NOTE: This
step isn't always easy. I then pour some solvent down, work the grip
a little, and pour some more. It's only necessary to work the grip
loose about 1/2". Then I place a plastic tube over the shaft, leaving
about 1" of the butt exposed, and finish the job with the air
compressor. It works great. It's not always as easy as it may sound,
but take your time and it will work ok.


John G. Bowman
clubfitter@mindspring.com


------------------------------

From: Dorran Delay <dorran@connix.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 21:20:04 -0400
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Head Re-weighting

I need a way to remove the foam out of a metal head for weight purposes.

Suggestions?

dorran@connix.com

------------------------------

From: Dorran Delay <dorran@connix.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 21:26:23 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: weight

Can someone tell me how to remove the foam from a metal head?

Thank you.

------------------------------

From: "Scott" <golfscot@netcom.industry.net>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 21:29:02 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: Forged irons +

Anyone use Apache graphite shafts ? How are they ?
Anyone use forged irons? Worth the price to make ?
Scott Fishel

------------------------------

From: YMRN29A@prodigy.com (MR WILLIAM F ABBOTT)
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 21:59:45, -0500
Subject: ShopTalk: Forged irons +

Have been installing Apache shafts for @ 3 mos. (5 or 6 full sets of
irons, @ 10 -15 woods)
Have had great success, I really like the way you order them per CPM,
have tested them on my frequency analyzer, and they are very accurate.

Give them a shot. call Steve Corwin at 1-800-275-3401 tell him I sent
you!


------------------------------

From: Barry Vonada <golfman@gvi.net>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 22:55:14 -0500
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

John G. Bowman wrote:
>
> On 24 Sep 96 at 10:55, Paul%CWOCMHS.CWOC@smtpgwy.des wrote:
>
> > If King Snake is now an 'illegal head' (to manufacture anyway), does
> > that mean that players using the head would be disqualified during
> > tournament play?
> >
> > Can grips be taken off of shafts and reused? These particular grips
> > are Golf Pride Tour Wrap (about 1.5 yrs old).
>
>
> I'm not sure about the heads, but heres some info on the grips.
>
> There are primarily two methods for removing grips in a re-usable
> state:
>
> (1) Using an industrial type syringe to inject grip solvent into the
> sides of the grip. This disolves the adheasion of the tape.
> (2) Using an air compressor, blow air down through the grip hole,
> causing forced separation of the grip and tape.
>
> The first time I needed this done, I took them to a pro shop. They
> used the syringe method and could only remove 3 of the 6 grips. I then
> borrowed a compressor to blow the others off and found it difficult due
> to the syringe holes in the grip. However, I did succeed.
>
> Now, I use a method that combines the benefits of both.
>
> I insert an air needle, the kind used for inflating basketballs,
> in the grip hole and get it between the shaft and grip. NOTE: This
> step isn't always easy. I then pour some solvent down, work the grip
> a little, and pour some more. It's only necessary to work the grip
> loose about 1/2". Then I place a plastic tube over the shaft, leaving
> about 1" of the butt exposed, and finish the job with the air
> compressor. It works great. It's not always as easy as it may sound,
> but take your time and it will work ok.
>
>
> John G. Bowman
> clubfitter@mindspring.com
>

The best luck I have ever had was with the Grip Removal Blade from
Golfsmith. I can remove even the most stubborn grips in about 30 secs
with this tool. It is well worth the money and is much better than the
syringe/compressor method (and I have both, of which I use no longer).

Just my opinion.

Barry Vonada
GCA Advanced Clubmaker

------------------------------

From: clubmake@ite.net (Ted Jr. Vida)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 17:45:49 -0700
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

Paul%CWOCMHS.CWOC@smtpgwy.des.state.mn.us wrote:
>
> If King Snake is now an 'illegal head' (to manufacture anyway), does
> that mean that players using the head would be disqualified during
> tournament play?
>
> Can grips be taken off of shafts and reused? These particular grips
> are Golf Pride Tour Wrap (about 1.5 yrs old).

I don't know if the King Snakes will be illegal for tournament play; but,
yes there are a couple of ways to possibly save the grips and reuse them.
But if they're 1.5 yrs old and you use your clubs at least once a week,
they should be ready for new grips. The recommended grip change for the
weekly hacker is once a year.

Ted
clubmake@ite.net

------------------------------

From: John Lunsford <jluns@interserf.net>
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 07:40:41 -0400
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: When building a 6, 7, 8 wood...

At 12:02 PM 9/24/96 -0700, you wrote:
>John Lunsford wrote:
>>
>> At 11:48 AM 9/23/96 -0700, you wrote:
>> >I am thinking of building a utility wood. My aim being to get the ball
>> >easier out of roughs etc compared to my 4-5 iron (185-200 yards).
>> >What specs (loft and length, head weight)) should I be looking for if I
>> >want to build this type if club and keeping the above distance. ?
>> >I am thinking of using the dynalite shaft (110grams I believe) tip trimed
>> >to match my 3 wood (16 degree, D1).
>> >
>> >Suggestions are welcome.
>> >
>> >Does the Copperhead only come as a driver or are there 3, 5, 7, woods ?
>> >
>> >Regards from Belgium
>> >Joakim
>>
>> Not sure about 7 wood, but I just completed a set of Copperhead 1,3, and 5
>> with matching Copperhead graphite shafts and grips. A very handsome set.
>>
>> >
>> >What is the loft of the 3 and 5 wood ?

I believe the loft is as follows:
1=10.5
3=16
5=22
>
>


------------------------------

From: "Vince Burkis" <Celtics72@msn.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 96 15:50:33 UT
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

- ----------
From: owner-shoptalk@conch.aa.msen.com on behalf of
Paul%CWOCMHS.CWOC@smtpgwy.des.state.mn.us
Sent: Tue, September 24, 1996 11:55 AM
To: shoptalk@mail.msen.com
Subject: ShopTalk: King Snakes & Grips

If King Snake is now an 'illegal head' (to manufacture anyway), does
that mean that players using the head would be disqualified during
tournament play?

Can grips be taken off of shafts and reused? These particular grips
are Golf Pride Tour Wrap (about 1.5 yrs old).

Yes, grips can be removed and reused. Golfworks and Golfsmith both sell a
steel pump. Filled with grip solvent, you insert the needle into various
places in the grip and squirt (pump) the solvent into the grip. This will
loosen the grip so that you can remove it. See catalog for more elaborate
information.

Golfsmith also sells a flat bar that can be inserted between the grip and the
shaft for grip removal.

Suspect that if the grip if 1 1/2 years old, you may want to replace same
instead of going through the removal process. It can be a pain.


------------------------------

From: "Vince Burkis" <Celtics72@msn.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 96 15:54:34 UT
Subject: RE: ShopTalk: Forged irons +

I currently use a set of forged irons from Golfworks and really like them.
It's a personal quirk. Over the last couple of years, I've learned that in
terms of playability, there isn't really any difference between forged and
cast - other than a stiff increase in price owing to the process used in
forging.

Am in process of selling same and will be switching to cast clubs.

- ----------
From: owner-shoptalk@conch.aa.msen.com on behalf of Scott
Sent: Tue, September 24, 1996 9:29 PM
To: Shop Talk
Subject: ShopTalk: Forged irons +

Anyone use Apache graphite shafts ? How are they ?
Anyone use forged irons? Worth the price to make ?
Scott Fishel


------------------------------

From: "Glaser Jonathan" <Glaser_Jonathan@bah.com>
Date: 25 Sep 1996 16:45:11 U
Subject: ShopTalk: Putters

Can anyone recommend a qualsource for putter components and standard putter
measurements (swingweight, head weight, shaft weight, length, lie/loft angle,
etc.)? The Raven putter heads look good but since the putter is such a
'touch' sensitive club, I am unsure about spending the $$$ without being able
to try before I buy.

More Qs:
How tricky is it to install a single or double bend putter shaft?
How is face-balancing achieved (and does anyone like it) ?
Is face-balancing independent of heel/toe weighting or can you get both?

If you have recommendations, please keep in mind I am (unfortunately) a lefty
and can't enjoy any of the numerous right-handed ONLY components available
from most suppliers (although others may benefit from recommendations). Thanks
in advance.



------------------------------

From: "Scott" <golfscot@netcom.industry.net>
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 20:39:51 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: Penick: Master or Classic

Please recommend which head should be used by some one playing 1 year
averaging 112 for 18 holes.
Harvey Penick: Master or Classic irons.
TT Lite "R' Shatfs
Scott Fishel

------------------------------

From: John Payne <jcpayne@randomc.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 22:03:20 -0400
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Penick: Master or Classic

At 08:39 PM 9/25/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Please recommend which head should be used by some one playing 1 year
>averaging 112 for 18 holes.
> Harvey Penick: Master or Classic irons.
> TT Lite "R' Shatfs
>Scott Fishel
>
I'd use the Penick Masters, they are more forgiving. I've made several sets
for people and they all like them. They also seem to be a very durable head too.

John in Duluth


------------------------------

From: djmiller@wolf.co.net (Daniel J. Miller)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 23:31:32 -0500
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Penick: Master or Classic

Scott wrote:

>Please recommend which head should be used by some one playing 1 year
>averaging 112 for 18 holes.
> Harvey Penick: Master or Classic irons.
> TT Lite "R' Shatfs
>Scott Fishel
>
Scott, I think you definitely want a cavity back... In other words, the
Master. The Classic is really a blade. Only 1/8" deep cavity.

I would also probably look for a shaft with a low bend point to get the ball
in the air. The Penick Masters have a stronger loft than most, for lower
shots. The TT Lite is a mid bend point that plays somewhat firm.

I used Penick Masters for the past year and a half. I sold them last month
and replaced them with Golfsmith Sterlings. I use Carbon Tour 5.0 shafts.
I'm a 9 handicap and have been hitting them a TON! In fairness to the
Masters, I'd been using a shaft that was too firm for my slow, smooth swing.
I probably would have had good results with the Master heads on these shafts
also.

Incidentally, the Golfsmith XPC-Plus Iron sets up very much like the Master.
If your customer is looking to save some money, this might be a great option
for him...

Hope this helps...

Dan

djm


------------------------------

From: John & Jeannene White <jjwhite@humboldtks.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 22:48:58 -0500
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Penick: Master or Classic

At 08:39 PM 9/25/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Please recommend which head should be used by some one playing 1 year
>averaging 112 for 18 holes.
> Harvey Penick: Master or Classic irons.
> TT Lite "R' Shatfs
>Scott Fishel
>

Scott:
Use the Masters head. Oversize, perimeter-weighted. High
handicappers need the extra help provided by the Masters head.
Good Luck!

John White


------------------------------

From: "John G. Bowman" <bowman@blueridge-ef.saic.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 07:51:08 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: XPC PLUS Irons

I'm a mid-high handicapper with a slow swing and getting ready to
build my first complete set of irons. I'm leaning strongly towards
the XPC Plus.I've heard a lot of good things here about the Irons in general,
but does anyone have any experience with the XPC bubble shafts
and grips? Should I be looking at another shaft?

Also, has anyone used Dave T's swingweight formula's?


bowman@blueridge-ef.saic.com
Vox: 301-878-6333, Fax: 301-878-4543



------------------------------

From: tedd_childers@ncsu.edu (Tedd Childers)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 08:29:33 EDT
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Putters

>Can anyone recommend a qualsource for putter components and standard putter
>measurements (swingweight, head weight, shaft weight, length, lie/loft angle,
>etc.)? The Raven putter heads look good but since the putter is such a
>'touch' sensitive club, I am unsure about spending the $$$ without being able
>to try before I buy.
>
>More Qs:
>How tricky is it to install a single or double bend putter shaft?
>How is face-balancing achieved (and does anyone like it) ?
>Is face-balancing independent of heel/toe weighting or can you get both?
>
>If you have recommendations, please keep in mind I am (unfortunately) a lefty
>and can't enjoy any of the numerous right-handed ONLY components available
>from most suppliers (although others may benefit from recommendations). Thanks
>in advance.
>
>
>
>Jonathan,

I have ordered many components from Raven Golf and have always been
completely satisfied. I always deal with Paul Nickles, who is a very nice
and knowledgeable guy. I just started playing with a Raven putter, the
TM-80 model in brass, and I really love this putter. It has a soft feel,
very similar to Ping putters. The head is quite heavy at 355 grams, but I
like a heavy putter. The Raven putters come in several models, with thw
weights ranging from 300-380 grams. I highly recommend that you try one, I
think you will be impressed.


------------------------------

From: tedd_childers@ncsu.edu (Tedd Childers)
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 08:33:29 EDT
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Penick: Master or Classic

>Please recommend which head should be used by some one playing 1 year
>averaging 112 for 18 holes.
> Harvey Penick: Master or Classic irons.
> TT Lite "R' Shatfs
>Scott Fishel
>

I personally think the Penick line of components is overpriced. Check out
the Raven Golf components at 1-800-236-4566 or on the net. Just type Raven
golf in the search field on Yahoo and you will bet there.


------------------------------

From: phopkin@adams.berk.net
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 12:23:06 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: XPC PLUS Irons

On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, "John G. Bowman" <bowman@blueridge-ef.saic.com> wrote:
>I'm a mid-high handicapper with a slow swing and getting ready to
>build my first complete set of irons. I'm leaning strongly towards
> the XPC Plus.I've heard a lot of good things here about the Irons in general,
>but does anyone have any experience with the XPC bubble shafts
>and grips? Should I be looking at another shaft?
>
>Also, has anyone used Dave T's swingweight formula's?
>
>
>bowman@blueridge-ef.saic.com
>Vox: 301-878-6333, Fax: 301-878-4543
>
John:

I am a big fan of the XPC Bulge graphite shafts. I have sold more clubs with
these shafts than any other by far, both for woods and irons. The reason they
have sold so well is that they are working well for people and word gets around
real fast when somebody starts winning money on Sunday morning. Make sure you
get your swing speed clocked so you can match the flex properly. And remember,
if you do put a set together with these shafts, measure, measure, measure. The
bulge geometry doesn't give you much room for error. And be conscientious about
coning, deburring and champhering the hosels. A very important set of steps to
ensure a long shaft life. As for grips, I love the new Golf Pride Tour Velvets.
For the first time, I'm able to play golf without a glove.

Good luck in your deliberations. You might consider building yourself a single
test iron with the XPC shaft. The cost is pretty low, and you'll then have a
real good idea whether you want to do the whole set.

If I can be of further help, give a holler.

Peter Hopkins
Catamount Custom Clubs
Pownal, VT

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End of shoptalk-digest V1 #14
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