shoptalk-digest Tuesday, 3 September 1996 Volume 01 : Number
008
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Tedd Childers <Tedd_Childers@ncsu.edu>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 96 15:56:48 EDT
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Dynacraft Clubs
At 01:36 PM 8/28/96 U, you wrote:
>Does anyone have any experience with the Dynacraft Oversize Irons (#5352)?
>How do they play compared to similarly designed clubs (Golfsmith OS
Project,
>Golfworks, etc.)?
>
>Out of curiosity, how much of a club's performance do y'all think is
related
>to the clubhead versus the shaft. (I realize that its REALLY 100% related
to
>the golfer). On a 'philosophical level' -- for the same golfer, do
you think
>its 80% shaft performance versus 20% clubhead or something a bit more
even?(
>70/30, 50/50, etc.)
>
>I have no idea why it matters but there's no harm askin.
>
>JGG
>
>I think that it is 80% shaft, if you include length, flex, grip size,
weight and material(graphite or steel) as shaft considerations. The 20%
in
the head would include the lie angle, head design (blade verses cavity
back), and head weight (which would affect swingweight). If all of the
factors between two heads are similar except for appearance, (i.e. both
have
same lie angle, weight and basic design) then the head has very little
impact, except for confidence and personal appeal. In this case the shaft
is
95% of the equation or more. The real key is to get the person fitted
properly, and then offer advice on the playing characteristics of certain
head designs, then let the customer decide which head design to use based
on
personal preference. Just my two cents worth.
------------------------------
From: eer1@osi.com (Ed Reeder x2716)
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 13:42:46 -0700
Subject: ShopTalk: Relative Flatness of Iron Faces
I'm new to this list, and club repair, so pardon me if this is old hat.
My question is "what is acceptable regarding the flatness the faces
of irons?"
Recently I bought two of the Dynacraft Beryillum Copper wedges (one
sand, one lob). When I put them face-on-face for a visual check of
the their flatness, there was a significant crown on each. I couldn't
get through to Dynacraft's technical line, so I returned them with a
note, saying to give me ones with flatter faces.
However, later in the week, I'm not sure if they were as bad as I
first thought. I did the same thing on some Ping-Eye2s that I'm
reshafting, and they were't flat either (but not nearly as crowned as
the Dynacrafts).
(My guess is that they are manufactured much like mass-produced wood
working planes, where the "flattening" of the casting is done
on a
"belt sander" and not by milling).
My naive minds thinks that the faces of irons should be perfectly
flat, especially wedges, and there should not be a "wood-like"
bulge.
/Ed Reeder
(An aside - previously I'd built some putters and their faces were
not flat either. I simply stoked them across a sharp file that was
secured to my workbench top, giving them a flat face).
------------------------------
From: Tim Cacek <tcacek@trib.net>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 16:32:12 -0700
Subject: ShopTalk: king snake
are the king snake knock offs exactly like king cobra or are there subtle
differences
------------------------------
From: TRGuenther@aol.com
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 19:53:48 -0400
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Club flex , Center of Gravity, Dave Tutelman E-mail
Address
In a message dated 96-08-27 04:14:11 EDT, you write:
<< Subj: ShopTalk: Club flex , Center of Gravity, Dave Tutelman
E-mail
Address
Date: 96-08-27 04:14:11 EDT
From: Joakim.Thrane@bebslint.origin.nl (Joakim Thrane)
Sender: owner-shoptalk@conch.aa.msen.com
Reply-to: ShopTalk@conch.aa.msen.com
To: ShopTalk@mail.msen.com
>I have two main questions or cry for help that you might be able to
help
>me with ? I was going to ask Dave as they are directly related to his
>articles (which are a treat to read) but cannot find a e-mail address,
do
>you have one ?
>
>1. I have a tendency to strike shots slightly towards the heel. This
I
>know is due to a swing fault but the fact remains. Could it be possible
>that I would gain from moving the CG towards the heel by adding weight
in
>the tip part of the shaft ? Could my club lie play a part in this ?
>
>2. I am a 1 hdc playing brunswick shafts. My problem is that the
>clubmaker does not exist anymore and where I live there are no one
who
>can measure the frequency of my clubs, SO I don't really know what
I am
>playing and cannot replace broken clubs either. I did however find
some
>information on my clubs. Could you verify whether these stats make
sense
>or not ?
>Has the clubmaket trimmed the shaft in a specific way ?
>What can I do to find the right specs if I beak a club o would like
to
>replace the set ?
>
>I have a swingspeed of about 82 with a 5 iron.
>5 iron stats are as follows :
>
>D1 swing weight, "standard lenght"
>headweight 260grams
>1.8 torque
>332 CPM
>6.0 FM Precision Brunwich shaft
>
>Any help would be really welcome.
>
>Regards from Belgium, Europe
>>
Sorry I'm not Dave, but I think I can answer your question #1. I too have
the same problem, especially with my driver. I have found that I
consistently hit the ball a certain distance from the shaft, and when I
use a
jumbo driver that point is off the center of gravity towards the heel,
resulting in loss of distance. I find that I hit the mid-size drivers
farther than the jumbo drivers because I hit them closer to the center of
the
clubface. If you are using jumbo woods or oversize irons, you may do well
to
use smaller heads (although with a 1 handicap, I personally would leave
well
enough alone.)
By the laws of physics, you definitely would move the center of gravity
towards the heel by adding weight to the heel. The problem is that the
amount of weight you would have to add would probably drastically increase
the swingweight of your clubs, resulting in a slower swing speed and loss
of
distance. You might try it with some lead tape and see what happens. I
don't think your club lie could have anything to do with your problem.
------------------------------
From: SmartGolf@C9.COM
Date: 28 Aug 1996 21:38:44 EDT
Subject: ShopTalk: <none>
I have been following the questions and answers given in the shop talk
e-mail.
do you have a separate column that has the questions from people so that
I might be able to answer in case I know the answer to help, or do I
just respond after the fact.
------------------------------
From: "Scott M. Herzog" <smherzog@nps.navy.mil>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 96 20:58:50 -0700
Subject: ShopTalk: (no subject)
My questions relates to swingweighting. First, is it really necessary to
swingweight Golfsmith component clubs? I built a set of XPC-2000 irons
a while ago and cut them to Golfsmith recommended length, but never
bothered to swingweight them. Am I missing out on something? Second,
where can I find a table of swingweight values, i.e., C5=204.75 D0=213.5
etc.? Thank you.
Scott "Whitey" Herzog
------------------------------
From: "Raj V. Rajan" <rajan@libra.autoa.com>
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 09:20:32 -0400
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: (no subject)
Scott M. Herzog wrote:
>
> My questions relates to swingweighting. First, is it really necessary
to
> swingweight Golfsmith component clubs? I built a set of XPC-2000 irons
> a while ago and cut them to Golfsmith recommended length, but never
> bothered to swingweight them. Am I missing out on something? Second,
> where can I find a table of swingweight values, i.e., C5=204.75 D0=213.5
> etc.? Thank you.
>
> Scott "Whitey" Herzog
Scott,
I play with a Golfsmith (O/S Project) set that has'nt been
swingweighted. I love them and hit them well (12 hcp).
Here is the swingweight table (source:- Dave Tutleman's
notes)
--------------------------------------------
Swingweight Inch-ounces Inch-grams
--------------------------------------------
C-0 196 5600
C-1 197.75 5650
C-2 199.5 5700
C-3 201.25 5750
C-4 203 5800
-
C-5 204.75 5850
C-6 206.5 5900
C-7 208.25 5950
C-8 210 6000
C-9 211.75 6050
-
D-0 213.5 6100
D-1 215.25 6150
D-2 217 6200
D-3 218.75 6250
D-4 220.5 6300
-
D-5 222.25 6350
D-6 224 6400
D-7 225.75 6450
D-8 227.5 6500
D-9 229.25 6550
E-0 231 6600
--------------------------------------------
Hope this helps. Regards
Raj
__________________________________________________________________
| |
| |
| MMMMMMM MMMMMMM |
| Raj V. Rajan MMMMMMM MMMMMMM |
| Automated Analysis Corp. MMMMM MM MM MMMMM |
| 2805 S. Industrial Suite 100 MMMMM MM MM MMMMM |
| Ann Arbor, MI 48105 MMMMM MMM MMMMM |
| MMMMMMM M MMMMMMM |
| |
| E-Mail: rajan@autoa.com Go Blue! |
|__________________________________________________________________|
------------------------------
From: ylwm0277@cyberstore.ca (Al McPhie)
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 06:45:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [none]
Please delete my name from your "send to" list. I sent this
same request
some time back, as directed by yourselves, yet continue to receive.
------------------------------
From: Reg Hardy <datanet@earthlink.net>
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 08:59:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: ShopTalk: Re:Wrong address!!
At 06:45 AM 8/29/96 -0700, you wrote:
>Please delete my name from your "send to" list. I sent this
same request
>some time back, as directed by yourselves, yet continue to receive.
>
I think you sent your remove request to the Shoptalk mailing list.
------------------------------
From: jhm@clubmaker-online.com
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 21:39:06 +0100
Subject: ShopTalk: Re:
Sorry about the mix up. I've unsubscribed you from the list. If you are
still receiving email after Friday, let me know. You can also go to
http://clubmaker-online.com/shoptalk.html for instructions on unsubscribing
yourself (although it shouldn't be necessary).
Thanks
>Please delete my name from your "send to" list. I sent this
same request
>some time back, as directed by yourselves, yet continue to receive.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The name golf arose by default-all the other four-letter words had already
been taken-George Peper, writer http://clubmaker-online.com
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
------------------------------
From: djmiller@wolf.co.net (Daniel J. Miller)
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 22:38:34 -0500
Subject: ShopTalk: Re: Lefty
Jonathan Wrote:
Hate to bother you at home/work, but as a fellow lefty (who is about to
build
his first set of clubs), I was wondering if you had any advice about clubheads
(even shafts) -- especially if on your road to a single digit handicap you've
played with some things to avoid or definitely try.
I just broke 100 this weekend (yes I AM patting myself on the back -- ive
been playing for 4 1/2 months) and have become serious about improving my
game. Therefore, I decided not to buy the $200 "starter set"
(which would not
help me get started anyway) and build 'em myself. So -- enough about me
--
any advice, stories, etc? Thanks.
Jonathan Glaser
Jonathan,
Don't have much advice that is exclusively for lefty's, other than you'll
definitely have a more limited selection! As far as starting out with a
good set, and making them yourself - here goes:
The first set of irons I made myself were Golfsmith Harvey Penick's with
Golfsmith Filament Wound graphite shafts. If I had to do it again, I'd
start with a "cheaper" set. I found them to be a little stiff
for me, and
also didn't especially like the tapered sole. (I hit them ok, but didn't
really "feel" them.) I sold them last week.
I am a firm believer that the shaft is 90% of the club. Definitely pick
a
club that you know how to hit (5 or 7 iron) and assemble it first. If you
like it, go ahead with the set.
I built myself a "cheap" set to use the rest of the year while
I comtemplate
what to build next, and was very surprised at how well I've been hitting
them! Golfsmith Sterling irons with Carbon Tour 5.0 shafts. I tip trimmed
the R-flex shafts 1/4 inch less than specified for extra "feel".
I would
definitely recommend the Sterling Iron heads. The perimeter weighting and
consistent sole have given me a higher percentage of "sweet" shots
than the
Penick's did.
Still playing around with wood combinations. I like the Golfsmith XPC Plus
heads - just haven't found the right shaft. May try an ultra-lite next.
Bottom line: Choose a less expensive set to start with and learn from.
If
you learn over time that you'd like to try something different, you should
have good luck selling a "cheaper" set than if you start expensive.
Also, I
bought a swing weight scale right away. Considered it part of the cost
of
building my own set.
Good Luck!
Dan
PS: Inserted this into the Shoptalk forum so everyone could see. That's
why we're here!
djm
------------------------------
From: TRGuenther@aol.com
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 22:51:44 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: Aldila Speed Fit Shafts
I currently play a set of Golfsmith XPC 2000 metal woods and XPC Plus Irons,
all with steel shafts (TT Gold Plus). I really like the set, but since
I
made the clubs 3/4" long and the woods have a low center of gravity,
the
swingweight of the woods is somewhat high (D4 with a midsize grip - D6 if
I
had used a standard grip). I am considering reshafting the woods with
graphite, but I want something that is light, relatively stiff, and low
torque. The Aldila Speed Fit 90 looks like it would suit my needs and be
in
my price range. My swing speed is currently about 88 mph, which I hope
to
increase into the low 90's. Has anyone tried these shafts? Has anyone
tried
them with the XPC 2000 metal woods? Any recommendations on other shafts
with
similar characteristics (90-100 mph RSSR, <3.0 torque, 75-85 grams)?
Any
help would be greatly appreciated.
------------------------------
From: clubmake@ite.net (Ted Jr. Vida)
Date: Fri, 30 Aug 1996 14:41:03 -0700
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Club flex , Center of Gravity, Dave Tutelman E-mail
Address
Joakim Thrane wrote:
>
> >I have two main questions or cry for help that you might be able
to help
> >me with ? I was going to ask Dave as they are directly related
to his
> >articles (which are a treat to read) but cannot find a e-mail address,
do
> >you have one ?
> >
> >1. I have a tendency to strike shots slightly towards the heel.
This I
> >know is due to a swing fault but the fact remains. Could it be
possible
> >that I would gain from moving the CG towards the heel by adding
weight in
> >the tip part of the shaft ? Could my club lie play a part in this
?
> >
> >2. I am a 1 hdc playing brunswick shafts. My problem is that the
> >clubmaker does not exist anymore and where I live there are no
one who
> >can measure the frequency of my clubs, SO I don't really know what
I am
> >playing and cannot replace broken clubs either. I did however find
some
> >information on my clubs. Could you verify whether these stats make
sense
> >or not ?
> >Has the clubmaket trimmed the shaft in a specific way ?
> >What can I do to find the right specs if I beak a club o would
like to
> >replace the set ?
> >
> >I have a swingspeed of about 82 with a 5 iron.
> >5 iron stats are as follows :
> >
> >D1 swing weight, "standard lenght"
> >headweight 260grams
> >1.8 torque
> >332 CPM
> >6.0 FM Precision Brunwich shaft
> >
> >Any help would be really welcome.
> >
> >Regards from Belgium, Europe
If you're referring to Brunswick, they are now called FM Precision Golf.
Try contacting Golfsmith International, Inc.,11000 N I H 35, Austin,
Texas 78753-9982 Tel 1-512-837-4810. They sell components including the
former Brunswick products. They also have an outlet in the UK. You can
try getting its address/phone from them. Good luck.
------------------------------
From: "Gordon Olson" <G_Olson@mnsinc.com>
Date: Mon, 31 Jul 1995 16:12:24 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: Wood Heads
Does anyone know where I can get persimmon
or laminated maple wood head turnings other than
Golf Smith?
Thanks
Gordon Olson
------------------------------
From: smart golf <smartgolf@c9.com>
Date: Sat, 31 Aug 1996 14:56:59 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: (no subject)
where can i get a sole plate for the 'ginty 7-wood? during a round of golf
the epoxy
came loose and is now lost. i tried golfworks, dynacraft, golfworks, etc.
all said they
can not help me unless i had the sole plate. where are these items available?
------------------------------
From: EBAQ09A@prodigy.com ( WILTON T ITAMOTO)
Date: Sat, 31 Aug 1996 16:03:34, -0500
Subject: ShopTalk: Aldila Speed Fit Shafts
I am currently using a golfsmith XPC Plus 9.5 deg. head with a
Grafalloy Prolight shaft.The Prolight stiff flex should be ok for
your swing speed.Ive built this club 45" long with a D8 swingweight
using a tour velvet light grip.I like the head heavy feel with the
ultra light shaft and heavy head weight.Try this shaft as everyone
Ive talked to has nothing but good things to say about it.
------------------------------
From: petef@moon.flanet.com (Peter Farris)
Date: Sat, 31 Aug 1996 20:29:15 -0400
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: (no subject)
>where can i get a sole plate for the 'ginty 7-wood? during a round
of golf
the epoxy
>came loose and is now lost. i tried golfworks, dynacraft, golfworks,
etc.
all said they
>can not help me unless i had the sole plate. where are these items available?
>
>
You might try Ginty Golf Co @1-800-761-1010
this is Besco, they handle Ginty equiptment.
Good luck.
Pete Farris
------------------------------
From: "John G. Bowman" <bowman@blueridge-ef.saic.com>
Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1980 07:50:51 -0500
Subject: ShopTalk: "The Judge" club
Has anyone every heard of a club called "The Judge" by the "Founders
Club"?. A friend-of-a-friend has one, that he purchased in some Pro
shop in Florida, and snapped the shaft at the hosel. I would like to
find an original shaft, but, at the very least, find the specs on it so
I can duplicate it with a replacement shaft.
1. The shaft is an 860S by Aldila, with the words "The Judge, Founders
Formula" on it. I looked in the Golfsmith catalog for an 860S to no
avail.
2. The head is a 10.5% #1 with the recessed words "The Judge, Founders
Club" on it.
Any info on the shaft/specs/Founders Club, or even a contact number at
Aldila would be greatly appreciated.
Also, is drilling (carefully) the best way to remove the rest of the
club from the hosel?
P.S. The young gentleman REALLY likes the club, so I'm trying to
duplicate it as perfectly as possible.
Thanks in Advance,
John G. Bowman
Falling Waters, WV
bowman@blueridge-ef.saic.com
304-274-5962
------------------------------
From: eer1@osi.com (Ed Reeder x2716)
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 08:44:01 -0700
Subject: ShopTalk: Golfsmith Jetstream Woods
Any opinions on these? They look good, but can't demo where I am.
/Ed Reeder
------------------------------
From: LODISE@mailgate.navsses.navy.mil (Lodise, John)
Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 13:09 EST
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Golfsmith Jetstream Woods
I build a set of Jetstream woods. The size is about a calloway warbird
(maybe a hair larger). The finish and workmanship is really pretty and
they hit real nice and solid. A black shaft really lets the silver head
stand out. I also built a couple of drivers with very positive
feedback. I didn't need to use the weightport, but it's a nice feature.
They come pre-coned for graphite shafts. I highly recommend this head.
John in Philly
------------------------------
From: MYKEYGOLF@aol.com
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 13:36:11 -0400
Subject: ShopTalk: MYKEYGOLF@AOL.COM
I'm new at using this computer. I am a club maker and I'm trying to get
into
the system.I had your info once and lost it. Anything you can do to help
would be great.
------------------------------
From: eer1@osi.com (Ed Reeder x2716)
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 10:56:50 -0700
Subject: Re: ShopTalk: Golfsmith Jetstream Woods
Thanks,
I was looking at some Calloway's, but I wanted a heavier swingweight
and the Jetstream's seemed like the ticket.
/Ed
> I build a set of Jetstream woods. The size is about a calloway warbird
> (maybe a hair larger). The finish and workmanship is really pretty
and
> they hit real nice and solid. A black shaft really lets the silver
head
> stand out. I also built a couple of drivers with very positive
> feedback. I didn't need to use the weightport, but it's a nice feature.
> They come pre-coned for graphite shafts. I highly recommend this head.
>
>
>
> John in Philly
>
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: "Glaser Jonathan" <Glaser_Jonathan@bah.com>
Date: 3 Sep 1996 16:40:28 U
Subject: ShopTalk: Standard Weight Steel
Any recommendations for a low bend point standard weight steel iron shaft?
TT
Dynamic Gold / Dynamic has a high bend point ( and run too stiff for me
) so i
was looking @ Apollo and Brunswick.
Does anyone out there play Rifle 5.0s -- do they flex closer to a Regular
or
Average steel shaft ? My understanding is that the Rifle 5.5/6.0 runs stiffer
than the Regular flex of a standard/lightweight steel shaft. Any thoughts?
Thanks again.
------------------------------
End of shoptalk-digest V1 #8
****************************